Ken Drysdale
Day 3 · September 10, 2026 · 0:27:50
Key points Ken Drysdale, a professional engineer and entrepreneur with four decades of experience, chaired the commissioners of the National Citizens Inquiry (NCI) from 2023 to 2025. He describes the NCI as a citizens-led, citizens-funded, non-judicial investigation into the government's COVID-19 response, with sworn witnesses examined by lawyers before independent commissioners. He says the NCI held hearings in eight cities plus Regina, heard 333 witnesses, and that about 22.5 percent testified about vaccine injuries. He recounts the fearful climate of 2023, with venues refusing to rent space and witnesses dropping out due to terror or family pressure. He relays stories of people terrorized over masks and mandates, and elderly residents in care homes he says were locked up and deteriorated without oversight. He describes the National Citizens Archive, a searchable repository of the NCI's videos, transcripts, exhibits, and reports totaling thousands of pages. He argues food and drug regulations were changed to make vaccine approval subjective rather than objective, and calls for those revisions to be rescinded, especially given vaccination of young children.
Speaker 1
0:00 So we're going to move on to Ken Drysdale as our next witness. 0:04 And, uh, Ken, I did not make a note as to whether or not you're okay swearing or do you want to affirm? 0:10 I want to swear on the Bible. 0:11 Okay. 0:11 So if we can get Ken the Bible, put that in your right hand. 0:16 Ken Drysdale, do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? 0:22 So help you God. 0:23 I do. 0:25 I'm going to introduce you to the inquiry. 0:28 Um, 0:30 Mr. Drysdale is a professional engineer, entrepreneur, author, and civic leader with more than four decades of experience in engineering, business leadership, and public advocacy. 0:42 He's a graduate from the University of Manitoba with a bachelor of science in civil engineering, structural. 0:47 He founded and served as president of Accutech Engineering, a nationally recognized firm specializing in Arctic development and complex engineering projects. 0:59 Over the course of his career, he's led major engineering initiatives across North America and internationally, and has served as an expert investigator and witness in numerous structural and forensic engineering cases. 1:13 From February 2023 through April 2025, Mr. Drysdale served as chairman of the Independent Commissioners of the National Citizens Inquiry. 1:28 In this role, he helped lead national hearings held across Canada and was a principal author of the inquiry's commissioner's reports examining the government's response to the COVID-19 pandemic, synthesizing testimony from hundreds of witnesses and thousands of pages of evidence into comprehensive investigative reports. 1:52 Mr. Drysdale, can you start by describing for us what the heck 1:58 is or was the national citizens inquiry because there'll be a a number of people that have no idea of what the national citizens inquiry was the national citizens inquiry and a lot of people just talk about it as the nci but the national citizens inquiry was a citizens-led citizens-funded Speaker 2
2:20 non-judicial investigation into what happened, what was the government's response and efficacy of what they did throughout the COVID years. 2:30 And so that was kind of our assignment, and that's pretty broad. 2:34 You know, that's very different than the assignment we have here. Speaker 1
2:37 And can I just step in and just share some with the panel? 2:44 There's a website, National Citizens Archive, that has all of the videos. 2:48 And I think people would just be shocked that it looks much like what we're doing here today. 2:53 Witnesses were sworn in under oath. 2:56 They were all examined by lawyers. 2:58 And the commissioners were completely independent of administration, which is unusual. 3:03 So it wasn't a group just, oh, well, let's call witnesses. 3:07 And the commissioners were tasked with 3:11 just relying on the evidence. 3:13 Administration could have nothing to do with them other than, you know, responding to their requests for administrative purposes. 3:22 And they were tasked then, based on the evidence, to basically make positive recommendations on how things could be done differently. 3:34 So just for example, you know, Irvin Student, who worked in the Privy Council office in Canada and Australia, 3:42 became an expert on the effects on children and education at the end of the pandemic. 3:48 And he testified and pointed out that while every province we shut down the school system, nobody made sure old kids came back. 3:57 And a large number of children never came back. 3:59 And he testified about the effects of that. 4:01 So one of the recommendations is if you ever shut down the schools again, but please don't, maybe you should track and make sure the kids come back. 4:10 So it's 4:11 It wasn't axe grinding in any way. 4:15 And in every province, all the health officials and health ministers were invited. 4:19 And when they were in Ottawa, the federal health minister and officials were invited. 4:25 But there was no subpoena power. 4:27 So, and I'm sorry, I just interrupted you. 4:29 Can you share from the commissioner's perspective what the heck this was like? 4:34 And then I've got a more emotional question for you. Speaker 2
4:37 Well, it was really interesting. 4:39 And also, I want to point out that 4:41 the commissioners were selected across the country and they were selected from different disciplines. 4:47 So we had a lawyer, we had a doctor, a PhD, and we had somebody in the humanities who had a master's degree in humanities. 4:59 And they were selected from Quebec 5:02 Ontario, Manitoba, and Alberta. 5:04 So it was across the country representation. 5:07 It was multidisciplinary representation. 5:11 And what we did was, it was really interesting. 5:14 We held 5:18 three days of hearings initially in eight cities across the country, starting in Truro, Nova Scotia, and we went across the country and then we came back and finished in Ottawa. 5:28 Then we held, a year later, we held three days of additional hearings in Regina, Saskatchewan. 5:34 We heard from 333 individual witnesses. 5:40 And I think it's important to this hearing today 5:45 that we didn't go seeking witnesses with just vaccine injuries. 5:50 Of course, that's the mandate here. 5:52 But we had 22.5% of all of our 333 witnesses either testified about vaccine injuries that happened to them, their loved ones, or they were doctors or medical professionals who were testifying under oath about what had happened or what they observed to their patients. 6:10 So that was a significant portion of it. 6:12 I think that's about 75 different testimonies contained within the NCI, which would be very relevant to what happened here. Speaker 1
6:21 Right, but the mandate was larger, so it was all government action, so education, 6:26 economic effects, social effects? Speaker 2
6:31 How the churches were affected, how the children were affected. 6:34 We looked at the finances of our country because we doubled our national debt plus or minus during this whole COVID thing. 6:41 We looked into regulations as to how the vaccines were authorized for use. 6:48 We heard from everyone. 6:50 We heard from doctors. 6:51 We heard from lawyers. 6:52 We heard from mechanics, people who drove a courier, people who were grandfathered. 6:56 grandparents to young people. 6:59 So we got a real cross section of Canadians there. 7:04 And when their experiences were significant, they were, you know, sitting here in this chair for the last three days, there was a lot of deja vu as to what we went through and what we heard. 7:18 And again, it was different for us because we were talking about everything. 7:24 And the commissioners 7:26 didn't know who the witnesses were. 7:28 So when we came into a room, and I want to remind you, it was a different time now too. 7:35 People were terrified. 7:37 People were terrified to come out and talk. 7:40 The venues were terrified. 7:43 I often say, you know, we started in Truro, Nova Scotia. 7:47 That's a wonderful place, by the way. 7:49 But people say, well, why did you start in Halifax? 7:52 We couldn't get a venue in Halifax. 7:53 They wouldn't rent us a room. 7:56 And then we were in, I can't remember the name of the place in Toronto, but I wouldn't go back there. 8:02 Nobody would rent us in Toronto. 8:03 We weren't in Montreal because we couldn't get a meeting room in Montreal. 8:08 We went to Quebec City, Saskatchewan, Saskatoon. 8:12 They canceled the meeting room for us a week or a few days before. 8:18 And we met at another interesting place. 8:20 So very different. 8:22 And we had witnesses dropping out. 8:24 I remember in Saskatoon, you know, because the commissioners were independent, we didn't know what was going on in the background. 8:32 And I remember we filed into the room, much like you guys do here, and we sat down and the four commissioners were talking to each other. 8:38 And what we didn't know was that the witnesses that morning all quit because they were terrified. 8:46 They were terrified about what you're still hearing today, but on steroids, so to speak. 8:51 You know, you still hear people, they say that they're injured and people start to feel sorry for them or start to start to empathize with them until it turns out it's a vaccine injury. 9:02 And then it's something you did wrong. 9:04 Or you're crazy. 9:06 Imagine that what was going on in people's minds in April and March and May of 2023. Speaker 1
9:14 And remember, the bank accounts had been frozen bank account recently. 9:17 So we've had. 9:19 People were thinking they were only locked down solely because of what the trucker convoy had basically caused the government to pause. 9:27 But bank accounts have been frozen. 9:29 People were worried about losing their job. 9:31 And so they back out. 9:35 Curiously, more people dropped out because of family pressure. 9:38 So we've had that here, Mr. Drysdale, where witnesses have dropped out because of family pressure. 9:43 So one witness we had selected, we'd scheduled them. 9:47 And then we get a call, my daughter-in-law's made it clear I will never see my grandchildren again if I testify at the Allison Inquiry. 9:55 And National Citizens Inquiry, that was all the time. 9:59 And we had another witness drop out who had also been scheduled, got through the vetting process, saying, you know, you want me to testify about my mother that died, but my other sibling died and the only one I have left is my brother and he's made it clear that he'll have nothing to do with me, but I need his support because I'm injured. 10:18 And so she dropped out. 10:19 And so that's the type of thing you're sharing. 10:22 Yeah. Speaker 2
10:23 And there was more. 10:24 I can't remember the name of the witness in Saskatoon. 10:29 He started to testify. 10:30 And in the middle of his testimony, he started to cry uncontrollably. 10:35 And what he said was he thought he was crazy. 10:39 He thought he was alone. 10:41 He thought he'd done something wrong. 10:44 And this was the first time he felt safe on a national basis to be able to, or in any basis for that matter, to describe what had happened to him and where it came from and how he felt about that. Speaker 1
10:57 To Saskatoon, do you remember the name of the witness? 11:01 I'll call her a little old lady and know that she'll be mad if she's watching. 11:05 So she's at the oncologist's office and she's basically just told she has terminal breast cancer. 11:13 And she's describing how, well, she can't receive the information. 11:18 She just needs to find a quiet place to basically melt mentally. 11:24 So she goes into a coffee shop, but she doesn't have a mask. 11:26 Well, she's got COPD and she's got a doctor's letter saying she can't wear a mask. 11:31 But they're confronting her and won't let her in. 11:34 And then somehow that gets to, was it a radio journalist? 11:38 Some big journalist in Saskatoon. 11:39 Radio journalist. 11:40 who on Facebook does a big hate on on her. 11:43 So she wakes up with the entire city hating on her when all she was trying to do was find a quiet place and medical excuse not to wear a mask to basically decompress with the knowledge that she's dying of cancer. Speaker 2
11:58 And she wasn't the only one. 11:59 If you remember the fellow in Truro, 12:03 who testified he had a heart condition or COPD as well. 12:07 And he had a doctor's note. 12:09 And he went to a certain store to return something. 12:13 Do you remember this? 12:14 And the manager came out and tackled him and started to beat him up. 12:18 And he's suing them. 12:19 I don't know how that lawsuit has gone. 12:20 It's been a few years. 12:21 And then the RCMP came and arrested him. 12:24 And it was all on videotape what had happened. 12:25 He tried to tell them. 12:27 He was an elderly man. 12:28 And we heard those kinds of stories everywhere. 12:32 over and over and over again. 12:34 So the folks, you know, one of the key themes that came out of that was that folks had been terrorized by the media, and then government intervention amplified that and sunk at home, you know, when the police showed up at your home. 12:51 Or there was a certain instance, I think it was in Manitoba, where they had the, what was it called, the Diplomat Program or something. Speaker 1
13:00 Oh, yeah, so to... 13:02 encourage people to snitch on their neighbors. 13:04 You were an ambassador, weren't you? 13:06 An ambassador to basically complain on your neighbors. 13:10 It was very Orwellian. 13:12 It was terrible. 13:13 And I think it was Manitoba. 13:15 So the liquor stores are open, but the AA meetings are closed. 13:18 Yeah. Speaker 2
13:19 And you know, it was, it was so people were so convinced it was the right thing. 13:23 I remember having a discussion and I won't say who, because that person was near and dear to me and it wasn't my wife, by the way. 13:30 Um, 13:32 But I started to talk to them about how the churches were closed and the liquor stores were open. 13:37 And this person was telling me how that was so appropriate because there was people that needed their liquor. 13:44 I'm not making that up. 13:45 And this is an extremely intelligent, well-educated person who I respect. 13:49 But that's how effective the propaganda campaign was. 13:55 This fear, this terror. 13:57 It turned neighbor against neighbor, husband against wife. 14:00 children against parents. 14:02 We took elderly people and we locked them up and let them rot. 14:07 And we had witnesses about that. 14:09 We had several witnesses about this. 14:10 In fact, one was in Regina, I believe it was, and she had been working in an elderly person's housing unit. 14:18 She had 30 patients. 14:20 And she described how before the vaccines and before the lockdowns, because we weren't just concentrating on vaccines, 14:27 She was telling us about her patients. 14:31 And she said the deterioration that happened after the imposition of all of the mandates, people wanted to die. 14:39 They were rotting. 14:41 And I said to her, I questioned her, and I said, so when you saw this incredible change with your people, 14:49 And at the end of your shift, you went to talk to the doctor, the attending physician, and say what you saw. 14:56 She looked at me like I was crazy. 14:58 She said, attending physician? 15:00 I said, oh, certainly. 15:02 They must have had a doctor come in to see how things were going. 15:04 She said, never saw them. 15:06 Then I said... 15:08 Well, surely since the province of Saskatchewan implemented these measures, when the regulator came in to check on the condition of these people, you know, these people who built our country and paid taxes all their lives, who were locked up in rooms, surely when the regulator came in and asked you and you told them what you saw, what did the regulator say? 15:29 And she said to me, there was no regulators. 15:32 There was no visits by the province. 15:34 There were no doctors to talk to. 15:37 They were just locking them up. 15:40 And I personally know one who was in there who had Alzheimer's and lived through the war and was in tears all the time wondering what he had done. 15:56 And they couldn't care less. Speaker 1
16:01 Now, Mr. Drysdale, just to drive home so that the importance, it was a different time. 16:06 So we've 16:08 The country had been locked down for two years, and then starting in February, running, because there were eight cities, it was weekly or biweekly for about two and a half months. 16:18 It probably is still not recovered. 16:20 But what the NCI did was it documented a snapshot in time. 16:25 We did. 16:26 So when people were terrified, when it was fresh, when they were still worried about losing their jobs, they testified, and it's videoed, and it's under oath. 16:37 And it's much like these proceedings. 16:39 But that could never be recaptured. 16:41 If those witnesses testified today, it would be different testimony. 16:46 And the vaccine injuries have clearly changed. 16:50 Clearly changed. 16:51 You've been sitting here for these proceedings. 16:53 It's very different, the injuries today. 16:56 So where do people find the National Citizens Inquiry videos and the like? 17:04 Just because it is another resource. 17:07 that ties very well into what this inquiry is doing. Speaker 2
17:11 Well, you're absolutely right. 17:12 You know, we prepared thousands of hours of video. 17:17 Every witness was videotaped. 17:19 We prepared transcripts, thousands and thousands of pages of transcripts. 17:25 And we prepared these incredible reports. 17:27 We prepared three reports concerning COVID. 17:30 The first one was in September of 2023, and it was in response to 17:38 the government deciding they were going to start vaccinating children as young as six months old. 17:44 The second report was issued on November 28th, 2023, 5,280 pages. 17:50 And then the third report, the Regina supplemental report, was just under 1,000 pages. 17:54 So as an engineer, it wouldn't bother me to sit down and say I'm going to read a 5,000-page book, but I discovered that most Canadians don't do that. 18:03 So we had this incredible, ginormous library of information. 18:09 And so what we just finished doing is we created what we've called the nationalcitizensarchive.ca. 18:16 And we've taken all of that, the video, the transcripts, the exhibits, the entire reports, 18:28 And we've put it into a system that is completely searchable, and it's searchable and friendly enough for a small child to use, all the way up to a serious academic researcher to use. 18:42 So you can go in there, and it's split up into different sections, and you can search by any keyword you want. 18:50 And it'll go through, it'll tell you what video it was on, where it was, here, click on this button, here's the video. 18:56 You can search the transcripts and it's all in one spot. 19:00 And, you know, we even thought of this. 19:02 Let's say you go in there and you're intimidated by this whole thing. 19:06 What will I search for? 19:08 Believe it or not, we've helped you with that too. 19:10 You can push a button and it'll give you 12 categories of different areas that you might want to search under. 19:16 And it gives you over 6,000 terms. 19:19 So if you were interested in vaccine injuries, there's a category for that. 19:23 You push the button and then it gives you several hundred different keywords you can just pick from, push the button, and it searches that entire archive for you. 19:31 Transcripts, videos, reports, and it'll take you right down to where that piece is. 19:36 So this is an incredible 19:39 research tool, not just for people in universities or lawyers or something, but ordinary citizens can get in there. 19:49 And if they're curious about something, anything, any type of a term, they can put it in this thing and it will draw all of that information. 19:58 So it allows people other than perhaps elderly engineers, an opportunity to actually have a tool they can use to explore this incredible 20:10 repository of information. Speaker 1
20:12 Can I ask you about how the report's organized too? 20:16 Because when you hear like 6,000 pages and that, I'm sorry, I'm a lawyer and I'm not going to read that, but it was actually, everything was made into bite-sized pieces on topics. 20:26 So can you just share about that? Speaker 2
20:29 Absolutely. 20:29 So we'll talk about the main report, which was over 5,000 pages. 20:34 But what we did was, Chris, this was before we started thinking about 20:39 creating an archive, a searchable archive. 20:42 But what we did was a table of contents of that report is like 25 pages long. 20:46 And if you're dealing with the electronic version of it, it's all in categories. 20:51 For instance, civil law, freedom of speech, media, vaccines, medical, it was all split up into a whole bunch of different chapters. 21:03 And that was even 21:04 broken down again. 21:05 So you can just simply go to the table of contents if you're using the PDF, and you can find the topic you want and push the button and it'll take you to the section. 21:14 And we did, in that kind of a format, we tried to make it as usable as possible. 21:22 So we split out the discussion from the recommendations. 21:26 And that particular report made over 300 recommendations across pretty much every kind of topic area you can think of. 21:34 So even when we created the report in the book, we made it interactive so that it would allow folks to be able to explore. 21:42 But the National Citizens Archive is the next step. 21:46 It's an order of magnitude step beyond that. Speaker 1
21:48 So we're going to actually hand out paper copies of that report. 21:52 You brought them to be handed out to the MPs that are present. 21:56 But I will advise everyone in the audience and those watching that 22:02 Eventually, bearing in mind that we're volunteers that are assisting Chairperson Allison to put this on, eventually there'll be hopefully witness pages with the video of their testimony. 22:15 And we've entered as an exhibit the full NCI report and transcripts in electronic format. 22:23 But Mr. Drysdale has brought for the MPs that are present today, 22:29 isn't the whole report, but it's part of it. 22:31 But I want to pull up the slide because I had a question for you. 22:35 You talked about an interim report and this is very germane. 22:39 So this interim report is September 14th, 2023. 22:45 I actually think I could be wrong. 22:48 I thought it was a week before Health Canada approved the vaccine for kids, but maybe it's a week after. 22:54 No, it was two days. 22:55 Two days. 22:56 Two days after. 22:58 But you had already you guys had already written this interim report. 23:01 And I just want you to speak to you guys had four recommendations in an interim report released September 14th, 2023. 23:10 And the first one is newly implemented revisions to the food and drug regulations related to the authorization of COVID-19 vaccines must be rescinded as they permanently exempt COVID-19 vaccines from the requirement. 23:24 to objectively prove the safety and efficacy as required under the food and drug regulations. 23:29 Why was that unimportant? Speaker 2
23:31 Well, the significant thing that happened and it was, you know, I'll keep that to myself. 23:40 What they did was they went into the food and drug regulations and before COVID, the food and drug regulations 23:49 I would describe as having an objective text as to whether a drug is safe and effective. 23:55 And it was on the manufacturers to prove that it was safe and effective, objectively. 24:01 They changed the regulation and they essentially turned it into a subjective review. 24:06 And what's the difference? 24:08 An objective example might be two plus two equals four. 24:13 That's objective. 24:14 Two plus two equals four. 24:15 A subjective will be, 24:17 What do you feel about 2 plus 2 equals 4? 24:20 So they changed it from objective to subjective. 24:23 So the new regulation only required the manufacturers to submit enough information that would allow the Minister of Health to decide that it was safe, but not proved. 24:37 And if there was information missing, it would allow the manufacturer to submit that later. 24:45 They didn't have to prove safety and efficacy. 24:47 And the other thing that this did is it created a huge, in my opinion, conflict of interest because the government then on this basis started to import in all millions and millions and millions of dollars of this drug that wasn't approved. 25:06 Okay, so think about that. 25:08 The government spent millions and millions of dollars on a drug that wasn't approved, and they're expected to approve it later. 25:17 You think if something goes wrong, they're going to be able to say, well, I'm sorry, we spent all this money and we shouldn't have. 25:24 So this is a little bit of a preamble to this. 25:27 So during this emergency authorization, they changed that. 25:32 They also forced... 25:35 the minister to accept the application as long as it would be reasonable to conclude that it was safety and effective. 25:44 So it didn't say the minister may accept, it said must accept. 25:49 And the last little part of that was it also removed the ability of the minister for a period of one year from rescinding the authorization. 25:59 So the minister's hands were tied first by 26:04 in my opinion, conflict of interest. 26:06 Second, by this must approve if he could reasonably make the assumption or reasonably come to the conclusion it was safe. 26:16 And then the third would be because of, I just lost my train of thought, I'm sorry. Speaker 1
26:21 Well, no, that's fine. 26:22 And we're, you know, we've got to wrap it up for time reasons. 26:25 But the interesting thing is, is at the time, the four commissioners at the National Citizens Inquiry 26:33 had heard more witnesses under oath than any other people in the world. 26:37 That's correct. 26:37 And then had been tasked with coming up with positive recommendations. 26:42 But you guys felt compelled in September 2023 before the full report to at least say, wait a second, we should put the brakes on this until safety and efficacy is proven. 26:54 And obviously we're out of any crisis in 2023. Speaker 1
26:57 So why not require proof of safety and efficacy? Speaker 2
27:00 Absolutely. 27:01 And why not? 27:02 weld this into the permanent regulation after the emergency had passed. 27:08 It just didn't make any sense. 27:10 And again, considering this was now going to go into children as young as six months old, when there was pretty much a 0% risk to these children of the vaccine. 27:22 Thank you. Speaker 3
27:26 Any questions at all from our colleagues? Speaker 3
27:30 Mr. Geisel, thank you for being here and thank you for that update and letting Canadians know of an additional resource that they have available to them. Speaker 2
27:38 We appreciate you being here. 27:39 Thank you. 27:40 Appreciate being here.